Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East

How do we come back from this?

S**t, we lost, was my first thought.  But I wasn't too surprised. We delayed in selecting the candidate and worse, there appeared to have been no canvass returns in the constituency. 

We need to face this fact - the next election will be a air war versus ground war one, and we've already lost the air war and there's nothing we can do about it. Gordon Brown isn't very good at presentation, and even if we replaced him, his successor would be dogged by problems in the international economy. Besides, the press has simply decided that they want a change in government, and there is nothing we can do to change their minds.

However, we do need to remember that we've faced a hostile right-wing press most of the last century and still managed to get elected nine times, thanks to an effective ground war.

The most important thing to understand about ground wars is that it's impossible to win them in three weeks flat even if you pour hundreds of activists into the constituency. For starters your opponents are doing the same and the air war is on their side. A good ground war takes at least a year, usually longer, to have an effect because it takes a while to build up a rapport with voters. 

The problem with Glasgow East and Crewe and Nantwich before it, was that the local MP's and parties had been lazy and had simply not done regular canvassing and leafletting for years. Neither constituency had canvass returns for instance, so it was guesswork as to where the Labour supporters were. Even when Labour people are found, last minute work will not get a voter to turn out, if they've been neglected for years and had their head filled with anti-Labour stuff from the press.
 
MP's leaving parliament for their constituencies this summer should spend their time banging on doors and getting their canvass returns up to scratch. Sitting around in tea-rooms feeling sorry for themselves won't cut it. Wasting time gossiping in tea-rooms all these years instead of canvassing has contributed to this mess.

We've all had a wonderful time these last fourteen years simply cruising in the slipstream of the national New Labour machine. The machine is broken now though, and we're not going to get it back barring some miracle (and miracles don't happen in real life). It's only old-fashioned graft of the sort hardly any of us recall, that will get the MP's back into parliament.

So the lesson is we all need to get out in our local constituencies and get our canvass returns up to scratch ASAP.  Some in the press are already talking about the Labour party being Obliterated. Obliteration is a serious word - it's no longer about the survival of New Labour, it's about Labour itself. But Labour will only be obliterated if constituency members on the ground allow it to happen by not doing old-fashioned politics on the doorstep. If we want the Labour party to survive, it's all in the hands of us the members, independently of what national government does.

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Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#1)

Right on target! The media have made up their minds but the public have not. My experience on the doorstep is not the hostility that is reported but a great deal of uncertainty and we need to keep communicating - listening and responding.

And if some members could apply the same energy to taking apart the opposition policies as they do to ours, that would be helpful.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#2)

This is the same as the "Lesson learnt from Crewe and Nantwich" and the "Lesson learnt fro the local elections" etc etc etc etc.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#3)

There is not one iota of evidence that canvassing achieves anything, other than to make a political party feel that it is "doing something".

These things move in cycles - governments start off fresh and full of hope, gradually becoming more tired with the public getting more and more fed up with them until they eventually get booted out and the cycle starts all over again with a different government in power.  That is democracy and there's nothing anyone can do to change it when a government is at its fag end like this one and the Tories in the mid-90s.

All this talk of Labour being obliterated is nonsense, just as all that talk about the Tories being obliterated was 10 years ago.  Labour will gradually rebuild their base and come back in a few elections' time.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#4)

You are missing a very big point here.   Following the next election, Scotland will have it's vote on independence.  

Should Labour lose the next election badly,  the SNP will campaign in it's referendum on one word - Thatcher.   The Scots hate the toreis - literally despise them with a vengance.    People will vote for independence just to get away from the tories and before you poo-poo that statement,  it is a rock-hard fact.   The SNP will gain not only the pro-independence vote,  but the ant-tory one as well.

So,  without Scotland and it's MPs,  Labour can rebuild all it likes, it will never win another election.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#5)

"So,  without Scotland and it's MPs,  Labour can rebuild all it likes, it will never win another election."

What goes around comes around. I remember many people warning Blair that devolution would destroy the union, but Blair thought that Labour would never lose control of Scotland and Wales and so he could guarantee himself powerbases to dominate Westminster. How ironic would it be if Blair was the architect of an eternal Labour defeat!

This is why the Westlothian Question is like a canker in UK politics. It must be resolved.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#7)

"So,  without Scotland and it's MPs,  Labour can rebuild all it likes, it will never win another election"

Sorry, this is complete nonsense. As we speak, Labour has a majority of English MPs, and has done in the elections in 1997 and 2001 too. And the 1945 election, and 1950, and so on.

It's a complete myth that England is Tory. South-east England maybe. But not the rest.

Voters adapt to any given situation there is. If Scotland disappears, then English Labour voters will become more active, to deny one-party rule by Tories in England.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#8)

Thta is true as of now.  Post 2010 will be a different kettle of fish.  Then the tories will hold the majority of the English seats and one thing you can virtually guarentee is that if they win the General Election,  they will publicly endores scottish independence as a long term means of gutting the Labour Party in England

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#6)

"There is not one iota of evidence that canvassing achieves anything, other than to make a political party feel that it is "doing something"."

Actually there is tons of evidence that canvassing long term, year in year out wins you elections. One example is Oxford, where they are very active on the ground and bucked the trend of the last local elections, actually increasing their councillors elected.

Further back if you look at the 1945 election - all the press were for Churchill winning, but Labour had made a HUGE effort on the ground and it paid off handsomely.

You sound like someone who has never canvassed and prefers to sit at his computer moaning and talking to like-minded people on the net. That doesn't win elections at all.

The other important thing about canvassing is that it restores the link between voter and government. In the old days (before people got bone lazy), activists went round from door to door, they knew exactly what was going on in their areas and what the concerns were, and fed the information upwards to MPs and government. There was a direct and immediate link between the party governing and those being governed. 

These days, government seems remote from voters precisely because voters arn't being canvassed, and therefore have no means of getting their concerns through to govt except by upsets at the ballot box. Instead everything is mediated through the media and what happens is that it is the concerns of a handful of self-appointed journalists who set the agenda and "tell" govt what voters are thinking. But do the journalists actually know themselves, seeing as they don't get out of London? It's a very unhealthy state of affairs and voters are unhappy about it.

We have to get back to old-fashioned politics and start knocking on doors again. I'm sure all the lazy net-heads will protest at this and seek to claim that all responsibility for being elected lies on the shoulders of the PM and party members have no responsibility at all. Actually responsibility lies with us members, else why be in an org like Labour? We are a collective org, not a feudal org with all responsibility and power at the top.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#9)

Two things.

1) The SNP are benfiting from a wave of anger in England about the West Lothian question, and other matters. They are trying to exploit some visceral dislike of the English dislike of Scots. I think we should have regional assemblies across England.

2) You're absolutely right that our heartlands don't feel betrayed. They feel ignored. To me, this highlights the case for abandoning FPTP. Robin Cook always said that having a form of PR, would mean that poor people would have their votes counted again (not literally of course), and that we would have to spend as much time courting our heartlands in Glasgow or Liverpool, or South Wales, with turnouts at measly levels in the thirty-forty percentage points region, as we would someone in Basildon, Battersea, Hastings etc.

I mention those three constituencies specifically. What the John Huttons and Hazel Blears don't seem to realise, is that of course we should target the Southern marginals, in towns and small cities. But we shouldn't target Tunbridge, or Hampshire.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#10)

They have PR in the Scottish parliament! - didn't stop Labour from getting defeated there. The people in Glasgow east were <i>not</i> asking for PR. They wanted the local party to pay attention to them and the local MP to carry their concerns to Westminster. Only the local Mp hadn't bothered in years. so they though, we'll get us a new MP. It's as simple as that

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#12)

I didn't say that was their concern. I said that it would force Labour to pay attention to their concerns.

Re: Lessons to be learnt from Glasgow East (#11)

Canvassing is always a good idea. But the issue Snowflake doesn't address is what we are saying and what we have to offer the electorate when we speak with them except for the good things that we have achieved, which we have - on the NHS, schools, Sure Start, tax credits - and to explain or apologise for the things we've got wrong. Purnell's getting tough on incapacity benefit and suggesting that dole claimants should have to sign a declaration as to whether the are on crack or heroin is hardly the kind of stuff to energise and revive the Party or the country. All this nonsense gets in the way of everything most members want to do. New Labour has calculated that not only our core working class vote can be taken for granted, but our party also - half of whom have voted with their feet...

Brown says we are modernising all our schools - which is fantastic, except that it's through PFI - which is not at all fantastic and will leave schools paying off debt for decades to come with apalling maintenance and profits creamed off by the city. It makes you despair. It makes me despair.

Most of my friends who have supported the party in the past now write it off as a right-wing joke - some are shocked that I am still in it.

No doubt our leaders are calculating that getting out of Iraq just before the general election will help us - well it won't I'm afraid, because it's too late, and we are also escalating our unwinnable conflict in Afghanistan.

I could go on, but I won't. But we need a coherent Labour policy to put forward not more Tory nonsense dressed up as "reform" or "modernisation." Let Milburn and Clarke and Purnell join the Tories if they want, but they won't take us with them.

Let's hope the Party listens to some of the ideas being proposed by the Unions this weekend.