Terry Fields R.I.P

The former Labour MP for Liverpool Broadgreen, Terry Fields, has died over the weekend.

It's been announced here:

 www.socialist.net

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/7480012.stm

 More info on Terry here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Fields

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Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#1)

Top bloke. Ran a pub in his later days, I believe. None of the greasy pole to highly-paid consultancies that today's rejected Labour MPs get.

"was expelled from the Labour Party in September of that year for his Militant tendencies" - do you think a journalist with a lack of historical knowledge misheard something?

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#2)

I didn't agree with his politics, but he did have one great suggestion, which could sort out the latest expenses row: a worker's wage.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#3)

A really good MP whom we treated very badly, as a party.  Not an episode in our history that anyone should look back on with pride.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#4)

He was a man we didn't treat nearly badly enough.

It took far too long, but it is an episode in our history that I look upon with a great deal of pride.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#5)

That's nice of you to say... (sighs) respect for the dead, anyone?

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#6)

Utterly  disgusting that people post  such horrible comments. Terry Fields was a decent man. If only  we had  more like him now

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#7)

I have no comment on Terry Fields as a person, he may have been the nicest, most considerate and decent bloke in the world.  I never met him, so I can't comment.  But I can comment on his politics and I will.  Respect for the dead does not mean you reinvent them, it means you feel sorry for their nearest and dearest and hope they are coping as well as they can with their loss, but it does not mean that we should allow people to suggest that he was somehow the saviour the Labour Party never recognised.

He was a member of Militant, along with Dave Nellist in Coventry, he sat as a Labour MP but was loyal to a Trotskyist Entryist Organisation that tried to take over and destroy the Labour Party in the early 80s.  I remember the meetings that went on to midnight and beyond as Miliant comrades all with the same jabbing right hand and faux Merseyside accent kept the meeting going as long as possible until the normal people gave up and went home. 

I remember being chased through the streets of Coventry by Militant thugs as I handed out leaflets for the Labour candidate once Nellist had been expelled.  I remember being beaten up by Militant members of the Anti-Poll Tax Campaign for having the temerity to suggest at a meeting that non payment would leave the poor and those unable to pay at the sharp end of the law whilst middle class kids from Militant would pay at the last minute and hope they had done their bit for the transitional demands that would bring about the revolution.  And I say that as someone who did not pay and acted as McKenzies Friends to many others in court - whilst the Militant waved banners and sold papers to pensioners who could not afford the poll tax outside.

I remember the vicious attacks on those who were from the traditional left, and right, of the party who had kept it going through thick and thin.  I remember being shouted at before meetings for not buying the paper or refusing to put money in the latest crackpot collection for some Trot front group.  I remember them undermining the Anti Nazi League because it was led by the SWP and setting up an alternative instead. 

I remember their dismissal of lesbians and gay men as bourgious deviation that would disappear post revolution. 

I also remember Peter Kilfoyle fighting a by election against Trotskyist and expelled Militant member Lesley Mahmood in Liverpool and all the hatred of real Labour people they expressed in Terry Fields back yard.

And, overall I remember the intimidation, the violence, the hatred that came with their politics.

The Militant were a cancer in the party.  They needed to be expelled and I was delighted that they were and that I helped in my own small way. 

So, we can be sad that someone has died, and hope their friends and family are coping, but I really object to the attempt to position Terry as anything more than a Militant MP who rode the back of the Labour Party to parliament and allied himself with Trots and Thugs who cared nothing for ordinary Labour voters and even less for Labour members.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#10)

Well Terry showed that you were wrong when it came to paying the poll tax or going to prison didn't he...

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#12)

What a bunch of self-serving guff.

Just limiting myself to the worse bits:

- I know of a current MP who attacked a pregnant Militant member in a corridor as part of the witch-hunt in Liverpool against them so don't come over all holier than thou about Militant members' violence.
- the idea that Militant members were all middle-class is frankly hilarious. Especially compared to today's New Labour types.
- anyone who uses "Trot" as a lazy insult is a bloody idiot whose opinions should be ignored.
- the idea that the Militant "tried to...destroy the Labour Party" is in the realms of fantasy land. Even if true, they never got nearly as close to succeeding as the current mob of criminals, shysters and Tories have done.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#37)

Well said mate

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#8)

I met him a few time and he was Labour, as for trying to take over Labour, like Blair and Brown you mean.

I look at the new each day and see many of our troops dying because of Blair while he runs around the world telling people it's better to talk peace.

I watched him make millions telling the Americans about how he went to wear with Bush the imbecile.

I rather see twenty real MP's like Fields then twenty like Blair or Brown, everyone is running around now giving Nye Bevan praise, yet they do not mention like Fields he was kicked out of Labour for his militant tenancies. 

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#9)

Terry Fields was not kicked out of Labour for his militant tendencies.  Terry Fields was kicked out of the Labour Party for being a member of Militant, an avowed Trotskyist Group that was a party within a party, committed to using entryist techniques and violence to take over the Party.  At one stage it had more full time organisers across the country than the party itself.

Perhaps that is why I did not mention Bevan?

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#11)

A working class hero!

John Wiseman
Editor
Merseyside Amicus Unity Gazette
Liverpool 2A/0538 Branch

The criticism is a disgrace!

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#13)

John Wiseman and e10rifles.

Militant were not working class heroes, not then and not now in their Socialist Party format.

I do not use Trot as a throwaway insult, I use it in its correct way i.e. to identify a group that was avowedly Trotskyist, that fought other Trotskyist organisations for the British franchise to the (pick a number of your choice) International, believed in permanent worldwide revolution and that the job of a Trotskyist organisation was to "support the national Social Democratic Party in such a way as a rope supports a hanged man".  So, let's clear it up once and for all.

Militant were Trots.  They did not support the Labour Party.  They wanted to infiltrate as a party within a party and then take over the Labour Party.  They had their own political goals and manifesto.  They had their own headquarters and regional offices.  They had their own newspaper.  They had more regional organisers than the Labour Party.  They believed in intimidation and violence to get their way both within and without the Labour Party.  In short, they were Trotskyists.  And Terry Fields was one of them - if you don't believe me read the helfpul link above to the story written by one of those full time Militant Organisers who organised Fields, Nellist and Pat Wall at the time.

None of this is disputed by anyone around at the time, including the Militant themselves (though they may argue about the violence bit).

So please e10rifles and John Wiseman, can you explain which part of my previous post was untrue?

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#14)

Nobody suggested that everybody in the Militant was a "working class hero" but I can tell you that every one of them I have met (which is a lot) has been working class and it has often been remarked that they were the only Trotskyist grouping with a basis in the working class.

Thank you for explaining what 'Trot' means. I think everyone is clear on the definition already, but thanks.

As for the violence, I'm sure some of it isn't disputed by their members. I was redressing the balance by pointing out that their opponents used the same tactics at the time.

Your lumping of "Trots and Thugs" together is lazy at best.

In summary, the inaccurate parts include:
- the description of the "middle class kids in Militant" who would pay the poll tax in the end. Maybe I imagined Terry Fields being imprisoned.
- your description of people who want to take over the Labour Party for their own ends could be used for pretty much any faction, especially New Labour.
- although I don't agree with their position on homosexuality, you have caricatured it there.

Finally, I'm not surprised at the anger towards the official Labour candidates after they had been wrongly expelled and their local parties shut down undemocratically. Peter Kilfoyle is among the lowest of the low.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#15)

e10rifles,

Thanks for your clarifcation. 

My by-the-steps guide to why Militant were Trots was in response to your assertion I was using the phrase as a throwaway insult, which in your new post you graciously accept I was not.

I accept that not all members of the Militant were middle class, but a lot I met in South Wales at the time were, and they did their best to hide it, including one I knew who used to park the car he had been bought by his dad a quarter of a mile from the University he went to and then walk the rest of the way.  I know there were some working class Militant members mainly in Liverpool, and I apologise for the charicature.  I do not however apologise for my analysis that the Militant which did so much to make Labour unelectable in the early  and mid 80s were not in any way working class heroes.

I also accept there may have been some violence and intimidation from the other side in the 80s, but it was not systematic and part of the organisational approach of the core Labour Party at the time as it was with the Militant. 

But I think we should put to bed the school boy attempts to link the political tactics and analysis of the entryist Militant organisation to Tony Blair.

Just look at the results of the 1994 leadership election.  Blair got 52% of unions; 58% of CLPs; and 60% of MPs in the election for an overall total of 57%.  Prescott got 24% and Beckett got 19%.  This was not a subversive take over, he stood up and said I am new Labour, he used the phrase during his election campaign hence all the worry that he was going to change the name of the party, and even when faced with the then acting Leader in Margaret Beckett and a working class hero in John Prescott over half of all sections of the Labour Party voted for him in an open election.

Now if David Nellist had stood up and said, I am Militant Labour, and had got 50% of the vote in each section we would have a comparable ball game.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#16)

I disagree with several more things here, not least that Militant made Labour unelectable. They were actually quite successful in the areas where they had MPs and councillors. What made Labour unelectable was the hysterical reaction to them and Kinnock basically telling the world "the Labour Party is full of communist lunatics, don't vote for us".

Also, Dave Nellist and the others never hid their politics even if they were dishonest about their organisation. They did stand up and say "we believe in x, y, z" and they got elected. It was a bureaucratic manoeuvre which Stalin would have been proud of that got rid of them.

And I was referring to the takeover of ideas: neither Trotskyism nor New Labour were part of the mainstream of Labour opinion. I don't think if the members, unions (were the members balloted?) and MPs would have given Blair anything like 57% if they had a true understanding of what was going to be involved.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#17)

To a certain extent, Kinnock did the media's job for them, by saying that Labour was overrun with Militant members.

The tragedy is, that if Callaghan had called an autumn election for 1978, Militant would never have gained a foothold in areas like Liverpool, and the left would not have broken up. It was recognised that whoever won in '78/'79 would win the next election. Either Thatcher would use North Sea oil to cut taxes, or Labour would use it to raise public spending. Labour could have become the natural party of government.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#18)

What do you mean Kinnock did the job for them by pointing out Militant? 

Kinnock was not leader in 1983 when we lost the election, Michael Foot was.  He was once being expelled himself in his earlier days and spent many years refusing to move against Militant because of his belief in winning the battle of ideas and not using organisational tools to beat the entryists.  But even he was eventually moved by sheer weight of evidence against Militant to move against them, however ineffectually.

So you can't blame Kinnock for 1983.  He did not go for Militant until 1985, I was there and I remember Eric Heffer walking off the stage and Derek Hatton screaming abuse at the stage. 

Kinnock only did one thing before 1985 that helped stop the march of Militant and that was to refuse to vote for Tony Benn in the deputy leadership election against Dennis Healey.  We would still be in opposition now if Neil Kinnock had not taken that decision, had not made his 1985 speech, and had not started to turn Labour into an electable, professional, political party in the late 80s.  And no, before you all get excited, I am not saying Tony Benn was a Trotskyist or a member of Militant, but he defended them and they supported him.

Neil Kinnock, now there is a working class hero!

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#19)

"We would still be in opposition now if Neil Kinnock had not taken that decision, had not made his 1985 speech, and had not started to turn Labour into an electable, professional, political party in the late 80s."

Counter-factual history. Love it.

 

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#20)

I can't agree with you about Kinnock, who was not the most impressive Labour leader. Nor can I agree about Benn, nor much else in your analysis frankly.

I never witnessed intimidation associated with Militant - I'm not saying it never happened but personally I never saw any sign of it with the Militant members I met. Although I didn't agree with their "democratic centralism," the people I met seemed decent people (and overwhelmingly working class too).

Benn was right to defend Militant against expulsion. Labour's broad church as always included Marxism - right from the very beginning with the Social Democratic Federation, and later on, leading intellectuals like Stafford Cripps. The Labour Party has always contained political organisations within it too - some part of the official federated structure (like the Co-op Party) and some not (like CLPD, Labour First etc).

Militant's concealment of their Leninst organisation did lead to a certain whiff of dishonesty - ludicrous really because it was not much of a secret.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#21)

This is just silly.  Tony Benn and others opposed the McCarthy-style witch-hunt - and quite right too.  The move against Militant was irrelevant to the public at large until it was publicised by the witch-hunt (which was the earlier point about Kinnock - very similar to Gaitskell pointlessly and inaccurately claiming that the party was over-run with Communists in the 1950s), but it was hugely damaging to the Labour Party, gutting our youth movement (it has never properly recovered) and removing people who were very effective at recruiting young people, and people in communities that have since proved apathetic or marginalised.  Those people were often brought in via Militant (just as some New Labour types were brought in via discos) but they became excellent Labourites.

Kinnock's decision not to support Tony for the Deputy Leadership election was only of benefit to himself (it probably secured his elevation to the leadership) - it was hugely damaging to the left and, I think, to the party as a whole.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#23)

Absolutely right about the   youth wing. The LPYS (Labour Party Young Socilaists)    was closed down by Kinnock because it was dominated by Militant.
But  I can recall going to its annual conference and there were nearly as  many young members  there then as you will see this year  in Manchester. We  had    our   own newspaper "Left"  and support from the Tribune Group   as well as  the Millys. What  have  we  got now? Young Labour, an anodyne, toothless organisation. If I were 18  and idealistic I would not  touch  it   with a  bargepole.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#24)

Sadly true...

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#36)

Proudvotinglabour is entirely right on this. I never met Terry Fields and I'm sure he was a decent man. But his party was not the Labour Party; he and his comrades owed their loyalty to a party whose Trotskyist philosophy was in direct opposition to the Labour Party's democratic philosophy. Kinnock's 1985 speech to conference in Bournemouth was exhilerating, inspiring and... right. The whole party breathed a sigh of releif at that point, because we could all actually say out loud what we already knew - that tolerance of an entryist, Trotskyite organisation within our party was simply wrong and misguided. Militant and their fellow travellers did our party enormous damage and if we had not expelled them we would still be in opposition.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#38)

true - and we all really know it

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#39)

Whatever happened to our broad church? There have been Marxists in the party from the beginning. Less often Trotskyists, because they generally eschewed the Labour Party, rather than the other way around.

Your history lacks a certain logic. After Kinnock supposedly saved the party by attacking Militant in 1985 we went on for another 12 years before actually winning an election. Hardly a convincing link?

Your history lacks a certain accuracy. "The whole party breathed a sigh of relief at that point." Clearly innaccurate because there was considerable opposition to the purge of Militant.

And who were your "fellow travellers" - a kind of McCarthyite insult. Do you believe in guilt by association?

The "fellow travellers" slur reveals the real target of Kinnock - the socialist left. How ironic that you contrast Militant, this Trostkyist organisation, with the "Labour Party's democratic philosophy." Because, although the Party still believes in Parliamentary democracy, Kinnock's purge of Militant in 1985 could be said to be the beginning of the process that turned our democratic party into a kind of neo-liberal democratic centralist organisation - a perverse mirror to the Militant tendency. What a sad irony.

Benn's defence of Militant was undoubtedly a defence of the socialist tradition in the party, but importantly also, of the broad church - of a kind of pluralism. Fortunately two decades of attempts to purge socialism from the Party have not been successful. Socialism is a very necessary political current - even more so perhaps with the current crisis of international capitalism.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#22)

Firstly and most importantly our thoughts must go out to Terry's family who will be going through a tremendous amount of grief at this time. 

I think that back in the time Terry became an MP the mainstream of the Labour Party would have had more in common with Militant than with New Labour.  Obviously, Trostkyist entryism has no part in the Labour Party but Terry's policies of unilateral disarnament, public ownership, taxation of the rich and worker control DID incorporate the mainstream of party thinking in the 1980's. 

I strongly concur with the previous comment that both Trotskyist entryism and New Labour are both extremes within the natural positioning of Labour Party thought.

As a previous commentator of the right wing pointed out that Blair won the 94 Leadership contest fairly and squarly.  This is true, but there was nothing within that leadership contest about replacing clause IV, abandoning redistribution of wealth, privatisation and a pro neo con foreign policy.  Even Blair at the time of the contest said the return of the water industry into public ownership was justifiable. 

Once he had the leadership he then duped us by turning into the most right wing leader the party has ever had.  At least Terry was a conviction politician who stood by his class and was prepared to go to jail for his beliefs.  You should remember how terrible the Poll Tax was with people on benefits having to pay a proportion towards local taxation.

If Blair and Fields had both said what they believed at an 80's Labour Party meeting it would be Blairs balls hanging from the ceiling, not Terry's.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#25)

"If Blair and Fields had both said what they believed at an 80's Labour Party meeting it would be Blairs balls hanging from the ceiling, not Terry's"

There it is folks, in one sentence, why Labour lost throughout the 80s and it took us until 1997 to recover.

I cannot believe that people on this site are putting so much energy into defending Militant and Tony Benn and attacking Tony Blair and Neil Kinnock.

Tony Benn's analysis that the 1983 election result was "8 million votes for socialism" showed just how out of touch he and his mates were with the country at that time.  The manifesto was a disaster, the campaign was a disaster, and the fact that Margaret Thatcher ended up with a majority of well over 100 was a disaster for the people you claim were represented by Militant and Benn, the people who really needed our help.

And as for the post about Marxism has always had a place in the broad church of the Labour Party, nonsense on a stick.  The original Clause 4 was written with the express purpose of differentiating the Labour brand of socialism from communism and marxism and the Social Democratic Federation that someone mentioned were the first group expelled from the Labour Party just a couple of years after the party was formed.

Marxism/Communism/Leninism/Trotskyism has never and should never have a place in our Party.  The founders knew that and the mainstream of the party throughout our history has known that, and that apart from being a whiff of dishonesty is why groups like Militant, Socialist Outlook, Socialist Organiser et all have all tried to hide their organisations.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#26)

Another load of crap.

First of all, the 1983 election was always going to be difficult because of Thatcher's north sea windfall and the Falklands War. It was made even more difficult by the SDP and the final straw was senior MPs going round the country telling the electorate that the manifesto was rubbish and they wouldn't implement it.

It was largely the fault of the right wing of the Labour Party (and General Galtieri) that the 1983 election was lost.

As for the rest, you seem to struggle to differentiate between Marxism and communism. Clause 4: "To secure for the workers by hand or by brain the full fruits of their industry and the most equitable distribution thereof that may be possible upon the basis of the common ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange, and the best obtainable system of popular administration and control of each industry of service." is explicitly Marxist in its description of workers' control of industry. That is not the same as revolutionary communism, which is a different sub-strain of Marxism.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#27)

Indeed, had Labour been in power, Galtieri would never have pounced. She did not save us from humiliation, she almost left us humiliated.

Also though, I believe that Benn did damage to the party, but so did the SDP. They should've stayed. The right would've gained control over the NEC much faster had they stayed.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#40)

Utter crap.

I suggest you do some reading around the period before spouting The Sun style political pseudo-analysis.

Try starting with Michael Foot's 'Another Heart and Other Pulses' and spread out from there.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#28)

Marxism has always had a place in the Labour Party.  Michael Foot said in a TV interview in the 1960's he considered himself to be influenced by Marxist thought. 

Benn and other have also been influenced but combined it with Christian Socialism and the like.  It is a legitimate strand of thought in Labour Party thinking.  What Marx did say was not particularly radical, it was simply common sense that a five year old child could have pointed out.  Basically, that it is unfair that working people who create the wealth of an enterprise don't have control over how it is distributed and have a proportion of it taken off them by a minority who own the productive means. 

As for Labour in the 1980's.  Well the split of by the SDP cost them dozens of seats.  The Liberal vote increased from around 13% to the nearly 30%.  Much of this was to the SDP.  If the right wing had stayed in the party and argued for what they believed now, Thatcher's majority would not have been so big.  Indeed, it might not have existed at all.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#29)

I am on the left wing of New Labour, but I would agree Marxism has a place. I happily admit I am heavily influenced by Rosa Luxembourg and Karl Marx, but also by libertarians and classical liberals like Milton Friedman and Ayaan Hirsi Ali. But I am not comfortable with the Militant's techniques.

However, every person on the left is influenced (whether they would like to admit it or not) by Marx.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#30)

I worked in Liverpool in the late 1970s/early 1980s as Militant were growing stronger. I cannot comment on Terry Fields as an individual.
But I can say this : Militant brought Labour and the Trade Union movement into as much disrepute as the Blair/Brown partnership : and if they had ever gained power- heaven forbid- would have destroyed Britain's economic base.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#31)

And I can say this: from having read plenty of your previous postings I would assume everything you say is approximately 180 degrees from reality.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#32)

You are entilted to your opinion.
I remember 1983: michale Foot was rather like Gordon Brown: a man chosen to be Labour Leader who - despite his many great abilities - was clealry unsuited to the job.

As for Militant, how many jobs did they save? They remind me of Arthur Scargill who almost single handed helped destroy the NUM.

 Militant achieved nothing: fact.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#33)

Thanks for entitling me to my opinion, that's very generous of you. If you want to discuss Michael Foot I'd suggest a new thread. Similarly Arthur Scargill. This one was about Terry Fields and the Militant - each very different political animals.

If you mean they achieved very little in Liverpool, I would necessarily disagree, but given they weren't in charge for that long it would hardly be earth-shattering news.

Still, just time for a copy and paste to refresh your memory before I go to the pub:

* 6,300 families rehoused from tenements, flats and maisonettes
* 2, 873 tenement flats demolished
* 1,315 walk-up flats demolished
* 2,086 flats/maisonettes demolished
* 4,800 houses and bungalows built
* 7,400 houses and flats improved
* 600 houses/bungalows created by ‘top-downing’ 1,315 walk-up flats
* 25 new Housing Action Areas being developed
* 6 new nursery classes built and open
* 17 Community Comprehensive Schools established following a massive re-organisation
* £10million spent on school improvements
* Five new sports centres, one with a leisure pool attached, built and open
* Two thousand additional jobs provided for in Liverpool City Council Budget
* Ten thousand people per year employed on Council’s Capital Programme
* Three new parks built
* Rents frozen for five years

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#45)

The Labour Party in Liverpool have still not recovered from the achievements of Militant.  I don't know anything about Terry Fields personally, but Militant was a centralised conspiratorial and anti-democratic organisation with a fundamental assumption that it could and should manipulate the working class and that the Labour Party was the best tool for the purpose.  It was indeed more working class than the other leftist groups (and I speak as one who was a member of the SWP at the time) probably because the leadership found it easier to manipulate people who had less education.  It made the SWP look like a model of openness and democracy.  Not to mention social enlightenment.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#47)

In my personal opinion Leninism and democratic centralism have hampered the left. I should have thought that Militant's model of party organisation was very little different from the SWP - classic democratic centralism was it not?

You may be a little harsh (maybe even patronising) when you say the Militant leadership probably "found it easier to manipulate people who had less education" in accounting for their working class membership. Militant supporters (members) that I knew at the time (not in Liverpool) were marked by a certain earnestness rather than the kind of cynicism you imply and were proud of their working class membership as well as being very keen indeed on education (Marxist Leninist education of course). Maybe your experience was different.

But the wider point is that the purge of Militant signalled the start of a wider attack, not only on socialists, but on the whole democratic apparatus of the Labour Party, and a ruthless centralisation of control of the Labour Party that Lenin himself would have been proud of (although he would not have liked New Labour's politics very much!).


Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#34)

You forgot the 30,000 redundancy notices, .. etc.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#46)

You forget that none of them were actually made redundant. It was a stupid tactic at the time, and one which the Militant leadership actually disagreed with, not to mention one which gave Kinnock his great quote, but nobody was actually made redundant.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#35)

Ironically though the Leader of the Labour Council in Liverpool in the 80's wasn't a militant but was a Bennite.  Militant were in a minority on the Labour Group.

Collectively, I can understand why they tried such radical measures.  Some of the wards in Liverpool had unemployment rates of 60% or over. 

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#41)

Terry Fields was a liar. He lied about the Militant - as did all its members.

That's a fact.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#42)

And what of our last Prime Minister? Only the consequences of, at the very least, distorting the truth and misleading parliament were far more serious.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#43)

You can argue all day and all night about what Tony Blair said, but I dispute he told any lies. And that's the point, it's a matter of opinion, not fact.

It's an undisputed fact that members of the Militant Tendency (or, to give it its proper name, the Revolutionary Socialist League) lied about the existence of the organisation, which was, of course a separate party organised on Leninist lines with its' own discipline and programme.

Re: Terry Fields R.I.P (#44)

I was never very keen on their Leninism personally, but in actual fact there are many organisations within the party, both official and unofficial that one could describe in this way - Labour First maybe?... who knows they seem more secretive even than Militant...

Maybe one of the Labour First comrades might enlighten us.